Were phorkys, keto & their siblings made of some sort of metal/mineral?

Alejandro

Active Member
Pontos (the Sea) and Gaia (the Earth) had five children who were sea deities: Nereus, Phorkys, Keto, Thaümas and Eurybia. Quite a few of the children of these five are said to have been partially composed of gold or bronze.

The three Gorgons and the many-headed dragon called the Hydra of Lerna were daughters of Phorkys and Keto. The Gorgons had bronze hands and golden wings. The one immortal head of the Hydra was golden. Thaümas' daughter Iris had golden wings, and so did Eurybia's granddaughter Nike.

What do you think? Were these five sea deities, and perhaps some of the Titans (like Hyperion and Theia, whose son Helios also had golden wings) supposed to be metallic beings, or maybe made of some other mineral? Hesiod says that Eurybia's heart was made of flint (because she was particularly cruel?). What about the rest of her?
 

Caburus

Active Member
Was it not a sign of their durabilty - metal lasts longer than flesh?
I don't think there was anything particularly different about the form of the Titans, at least not from that of the rest of the gods - whether flesh or not. Zeus appeared as fiery lightning when he took on his Olympus form infromt of Semele, and a shower of gold before Danae.
Other metallic characters I can think of are - the Stymphalian birds that had bronze wings and claws, the Cerynitian hind had golden horns and hooves, the giant Talos was made of bronze, the Golden ram had a golden fleece. But the gorgons wern't born with their wings and claws - they were transformed by Athena.
Other non-flesh characters - Pelops had an ivory shoulder, the Nemean lion had unbreakable skin,Nephele was made out of cloud, the fire breathing oxen of Colchis presumably had asbestos innards.
Perhaps its just coincidence with the children of the sea gods.
But flesh is peculiarly malleable in Greek mythology - not only the gods transforming themselves into other animal/human/elemental forms, but also turning humans into plants/animals/stone.
 

Alejandro

Active Member
Well, you've got me convinced! Yes, I think it might have something to do with durability, or at least value, I guess, what with all that gold (especially) that keeps showing up on certain individuals' wings, heads and fleeces, as well as Danai's shower, which I hadn't considered: thanx! :)

But isn't Zeus' appearance before Semele based less on his own physiology per se and more on the idea that the fiery lightning was part of his weapon arsenal? He wasn't born with his lightning-bolts either, though I'm pretty sure that, in the older version of the Gorgons' myth, Sthenno and Euryale were born immortal monsters, complete with the metal hands and wings, while Medusa was born a beautiful mortal woman, and it was her who Athena (jealously) had it in for since she was a little kid. Thus her transformation was based on the model which her triplet sisters already provided. Your mention of the Nemeian Lion actually ties in well with the question, since the lion was a descendant of Medusa. And your observation about the Colchian oxen's asbestos innards is super :D! Although, wasn't Pelops' ivory shoulder a divine prosthetic, coz Demeter had chowed his original one?
 

Caburus

Active Member
I suppose appearing in all his glory involved Zeus appearing with his thunder bolts, and they were what burnt up the poor woman. [Aside - any links with Dionysus being born from fire?]. Not heard that about Medusa and her sisters. Cinderella springs to mind - two ugly sisters, a prince and a cursed beauty, a jealous older woman and a mirror - no, wait, thats Snow White. Forget it.
Yep, Pelops was chopped up and fed to the gods, but got reassembled minus his shoulder. How come these reassmbled scenarios always seem to have bits missing? - Osiris lost his phallus, Thors goat had a limp. Did Zagreus have anything missing after his reassembly, or was it only his heart that was found?
Medusa's son, Chrysaor, means 'golden sword' in some translations. There's also a legend that Pythagoras had a golden thigh, as a seal of approval from Apollo.
 

Alejandro

Active Member
Oh, I hadn't heard about Pythagoras' golden thigh... I think you're spot on about the elements of the same mythus being present in the stories of Medusa, Cinderella and Snow White, though they may appear in different combinations depending on the tale's requirements.

I'm not sure that I've got your first question right (lemme know), but the myth of Dionysos' birth is indeed pointedly directed at the idea that he was born of the flames of Zeus' fire. Mostly by accident, at this son's premature birth, Zeus manages to achieve in him what Demeter and Thetis fail to do with the mortal children whom they attempt to immortalise when they bathe them in nocturnal fire. In this way, a part of Dionysos' mortality is washed away by the most sacred of fires: the lightning of Zeus Kataibates (the "Descender"). Another crucial part of immortalisation is achieved by immersing the fire-bathed fœtus, as it completes its gestation in its father's body, in the nectar and ambrosia [inadvertently] found within the thigh of the god.

As for missing body parts, especially phalloi, much of a muchness is usually made about them, in secret societies and mystery cults, about a variety of "spiritual" matters which they represent. Zagreus, the Orphic Dionysos, is supposedly a "stolen" version of Osiris, and I remember reading somewhere that Zagreus too lost his phallus to some indiscretion on the part of the Titans who dismembered him. The Egyptian obelisk, a gigantic column pointing skyward, is supposed to be Osiris' phallus, the "Finger of God," connecting heaven to earth.


 

Caburus

Active Member
I'd not thought about the fire burning away mortality. I gues that's how Heracles entered Olympus, by his self-immolation. Were there any other characters burnt up? Didn't Dionysus rescue his burnt up mother from Hades and give her a home on Olympus?
 

Alejandro

Active Member
Yeah, Myrddin, it gets even weirder in a certain aspect of Śaivism, in which the liga (phallus) of the Hindu god Śiva is worshipped as a god in its own right, or as an idol of the deity, and there's even a myth in which it is cosmic in size, saves the universe from destruction, and is thus given its due respect by Śiva's fellow gods Brahmā and Viṣṇu, regarding whom the myth acts as an argument that Śiva is greater and more powerful than they :oops:... Ahem.

Yes, Caburus, Herakles' self-immolation in fire definitely represents the final phase of his apotheosis, even though there are hints that he had gradually become immortal towards the end of his human life. And right you are: Dionysos did raise his mother up from the Underworld to Mt Olympos. I hadn't considered the connection between the manner of her death and her eventual deification. That now makes me think of Asklepios, who was struck dead by his grandfather Zeus' lightning-bolt, but at the command of his aunts, the Moirai, he was raised up to Olympos as a god also.

The Argive prince Kapaneus, one of the Seven Against Thebes, was stationed at the Elektran Gate of Thebes during Adrastos' and Polyneikes' siege of the city. Boasting that not even the fire of Zeus could prevent him from the scaling the city wall, he began his ascent by ladder but was zapped by a massive flash of lightning which resulted in such huge flames that days later, as his loved ones were committing his corpse to the funeral pyre, they had no need to light it, since his body was still on fire. His wife Evadne threw herself onto his corpse on the pyre and was immediately reduced to ashes from the same flames which were now some days old. Kapaneus, however, was later resurrected, among others, by Asklepios [before the latter was himself zapped dead by Zeus].
 
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