Reading the signs

fibi ducks

Active Member
A while ago I went to have a bath and found a caterpillar in the tub. It was alive and i dropped it off in the woods later on. I doubt it survived; too cold, and I don't know if i put it on the right type of plant.
It struck me as a thing out of time and place - in a bath, in mid-winter. So I wondered if it could be a sign. I interpreted it this way:
A caterpillar is a creepy crawly thing, but it turns into something beautiful. Therefore if I spend a lot of time in the bath I might transform ...
writing this down it doesn't look half as convincing as when it was just in my head.
Oh well, back to the bath in a minute
 

Myrddin

Well-Known Member
It struck me as a thing out of time and place - in a bath, in mid-winter.
I like that wording. "A thing out of time and place..." It sounds surreal almost. And indeed, finding a caterpillar anywhere in mid-winter would be odd. Thanks for sharing.
 

fibi ducks

Active Member
I like that wording. "A thing out of time and place..." It sounds surreal almost. And indeed, finding a caterpillar anywhere in mid-winter would be odd. Thanks for sharing.
hi Myrddin,
I got the idea of things being out of their natural order from a class in encient egyptian litterature. So that's where the idea comes from anyway.
 

Nadai

Active Member
Caterpillars are a symbol of transformation or rebirth. Metamorphosis.
Water (your bath) is also a symbol of rebirth or life. It can also symbolize psychic energy or an emotional state. It can be a symbol of femininity, birth, growth, or creation. Water can be calming or tumultuous, clear or murky, soothing or frightening.
Winter can mean death or darkness, but also a shortness of time or a restful state. To Persions, though, it is a sign of birth. The first day of winter, "Yalda", means birth. It is a time when people are happy and thankful for the good that will come once the sun reappears.
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Perhaps all of these things together, since they all have only one thing in common, are a sign of birth. Maybe not specifically a child being born, but the beginning of something in your life or the life of someone close to you.
 

fibi ducks

Active Member
Not quite on topic, but on the subject of winter, a Finnish friend told me yesterday that the 19th of January is exactly half way through winter, and is the day that all the hibernating bears turn over onto their other side and go back to sleep again.
 

magickz

Active Member
There are times when sometimes the signs are just not clear enough, then other times when we look back and wonder how we missed it in the first place. I have had plenty of moments like that.
 

fibi ducks

Active Member
I don't believe in signs and omens.:p
But I admit that unusual events can still dramatically affect us.
Fair enough. Me - I don't imagine there is an intelligence that put this caterpillar there as a sign. My first interest was in how someone in ancient greece might have interpretted it. But it does seem to me that there are useful ways of interpretation and must also be destructive ways, and these do feel real somehow, and make the sign real to me.
 

Myrddin

Well-Known Member
There's always been superstition in certain things - random events, particular animals (like snakes or butterflies), etc. - that has been passed down to us from our ancestors. They believed it and so we believe it, because they taught us to. I wouldn't think of it as destructive, exactly - just part of our way of life.
 

Nadai

Active Member
There's always been superstition in certain things - random events, particular animals (like snakes or butterflies), etc. - that has been passed down to us from our ancestors. They believed it and so we believe it, because they taught us to. I wouldn't think of it as destructive, exactly - just part of our way of life.
Perhaps a person's interpritation of a specific sign and their reaction to it could be destructive. If a person received a bad omen and thought to change the outcome they could possibly make the situation worse. A king could learn that his daughter's son will take his thrown so to avoid that he locks her away only to have her showered with gold and impregnated! Then he puts them in a box and throws them in the sea only to have both survive and his grandson later kill him! Maybe now-a-days it's a stretch, but back then I suppose it could happen.
 

Myrddin

Well-Known Member
Perhaps a person's interpritation of a specific sign and their reaction to it could be destructive. If a person received a bad omen and thought to change the outcome they could possibly make the situation worse. A king could learn that his daughter's son will take his thrown so to avoid that he locks her away only to have her showered with gold and impregnated! Then he puts them in a box and throws them in the sea only to have both survive and his grandson later kill him! Maybe now-a-days it's a stretch, but back then I suppose it could happen.
I'd think in any era of time that would be a bit of a stretch. However, back to your arguement of interpretation, I agree - how one may react to an omen could be destructive. That's not really pertaining to the superstition itself, though. That's more individual, and how it's analyzed by the individual. It's the weight of the belief, and how seriously one may take a given omen.

That sounds like the Greek tale of Perseus that you're refering to.
 

fibi ducks

Active Member
When my computer freezes up, sometimes I take that as a sign that the email I was trying to write - or whatever - wasn't such a good idea. This does at least help me in that I feel there was some benefit to sitting looking at the screen for ages while nothing happened. (By the way, I have come to the conclusion that I prefer waiting for a bus to waiting for my computer to do something. I think this is because if the bus gets really close, I'm not worried that it will never make the last little bit.) But anyway, the point is - how is it that this is a natural way to read this sign? I mean, I didn't have ancestors with computers who passed this down to me. It seems some sign are just asking to be read in a certain way.
 

Myrddin

Well-Known Member
By the way, I have come to the conclusion that I prefer waiting for a bus to waiting for my computer to do something. I think this is because if the bus gets really close, I'm not worried that it will never make the last little bit.
Now me, I'm not sure which I would prefer. Both aggravate me to the extreme. Quite possibly having to wait for the bus aggravates me more. When it's running late that is, and doesn't show up on freaking time!!!:mad:
 

fibi ducks

Active Member
Now me, I'm not sure which I would prefer. Both aggravate me to the extreme. Quite possibly having to wait for the bus aggravates me more. When it's running late that is, and doesn't show up on freaking time!!!:mad:
I think your internet connection must be better than mine. Or your bus service worse I perhaps.
 

Myrddin

Well-Known Member
I think your internet connection must be better than mine. Or your bus service worse I perhaps.
The bus service is horrible. Sometimes it doesn't even come, and I end up waiting double the time which is just aggravating on two levels. Level one, well it's double the time I have to wait, and in the winter in the cold, I can't stand it. Level two, it delays me from getting where I need to go, often school, for which I hate being late -- and that's not fair. You think the teacher will listen to you say that the usual bus never came?!? I sincerely doubt it. The bus drivers actaully wne t on strike a while back because they thought they deserved a raise. I beg to differ!:mad:
 
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