God vs. Goddess

AcadianSidhe

New Member
God vs. Goddess

In recent years, there has been a lot of scholarly and non-scholarly discussion regarding the origins of religion and the existence of a Great Mother Goddess archetype which spans most cultures.

Some people insist that the patriarchal religions overcame the more primal matriarchal religions. Some argue for the "sacred feminine". Some say this is all feminist propoganda.

What do you think?
 

VS Prasad

Junior Member
The Rig Veda is now accepted to be 8000 years old. It speaks of both
gods and goddesses. Worship of both existed since time immemorial.
The faith in both is somewhat similar to patriarchy and matriarchy
which co-exist in many cultures. No cases of one faith dominating
the other were recorded in history.

If you treat each small faith in the entire world as one cult,
including those practiced by the aborigines, then maximum number of
cults worship the earth as their mother goddess. The actual form may
vary from one cult to another.

The Upanishads say that Almighty is without any created materials.
He is the creator. He is beyond all creation. He is Infinite Consciousness.
He created Sakti (energy), a goddess. The worshippers of goddess
get extended life span and receive the energy to awaken their intellect
to understand Infinite Consciousness.

That primordial sacred Sakti (energy) is said to be present in every human
female. In Tantra rituals, a woman is worshipped as a goddess.

It is known fact in science that married males live 10 to 15 years
longer than the bachelor males.
 

greekgeek

Wanderer
You should check out the research of Gimbutas on that subject -- she's the one who's amassed rather exhaustive amounts of Neolithic evidence arguing for a cult of a mother goddess.

However, it's not quite as simple as all that. There was a cult of the goddess... a goddess... some goddess... which was widely revered in Europe (notice how this discussion somehow gets expanded to the entire world, I don't know why since the evidence is European and Near Eastern) -- anyway, that's not to say there were NO GODS.

It doesn't have to be either/or, it could be both.

Admittedly there are not god figures back at the beginning.

A second phase of this theory focuses on the pre-classical, pre-hierarchical states. Two lines of argument here:

1) There are a heck of a lot of myths where powerful early female divinities get usurped/overthrown by male gods. The female goddesses sometimes get vilified, demoted, or distorted into witchy/sinister figures. If taken seriously, it may be vestigial memory of a change in religion.

Or is it? Maybe it's simply justification for later sexual inequality. Nonetheless, a few examples:

-- Tiamat destroyed by Marduk
-- Apollo slaying the Python of Gaia and taking over her oracle at Delphi
-- Zeus, upon learning a child of him and Metis will overthrow him, resists sleeping with her (for a change) and instead EATS HER. Athena is born out of his skull, and declares herself born of man not woman, so she promotes men over women (at least in Aeschylus)
-- Many of the human women Zeus dallied with were originally local divinities, assimilated to the Olympian pantheon through a sort of forced marriage. Inscriptions and early evidence is fragmentary, but it's amazing how many of 'em turn out to be goddesses at the start.

2) Then there's the archaelogical evidence, which is more mixed. However, at least in Greece, there really IS a strong suggestion that early goddess cults got squashed. Examples:

~ Helen of Sparta was worshipped as a tree goddess and invoked in early Doric marriage hymns. Later, ironically, she becomes the marriage-breaker and a slut in classical mythology. There are still odd hints of her earlier divine status in Homer, though; her magical singing and weaving reminds us of Circe (who's on the way to demotion/distortion/vilification but not quite there yet)

~ Ariadne was also a local goddess, traces of which remain later in the Eleusinian mysteries (wife of Dionysos)

~ An amazing number of temples of Zeus rest on the foundations of older temples of Hera, back before she was shrew-i-fied

~ There is truth in the all-important Delphi myth. A sanctuary of Gaia is under the foundations, plus, down in the valley below, there's an Athena sanctuary plopped on the ruins of another part of the Gaia sanctuary, with Mycenaean period goddess figurines buried there

~ The Minoan snake goddess is all over the place in early art. Where'd she go?

~ Linear B tablets have Dione, Artemis, several other goddess whose names escape me now. But also, surprisingly considering his legend, Dionysos, telling us that we can't always take myths of where/when gods come in literally.

The latter again points to the idea that there were gods and goddesses, at least in the Greek region, early on.

So change the emphasis slightly: goddesses had greater stature earlier on. Minoan frescoes suggest women more equal to men, but otherwise our evidence for human as opposed to divine gender dynamics is too sketchy (at least in that area of the world) to say much.

Mind you, I really only know Greece and Rome well, Egypt and Mesopotamia somewhat -- oh yeah, one of the earliest pieces of literature in the world was written by the priestess Enheduanna, I think she was Sumerian? (can't remember when writing came in). There may be much or different evidence for other parts of the world.

My website (link in my sig) has a lecture touching on this subject by Dr. Chris Downing, as a matter of fact. She's written a widely-read book on The Goddess: Mythological Images of the Feminine and many other works, but unlike some of the wishful thinkers out there, she's actually a classical scholar and scholar of religion.
 

Rascaduanok

any% Speedrunner
Checking out your website at this very moment, greekgeek. I’d also like to point out that Arabic, a gendered language, uses the masculine to refer to God (Allah), but uses the feminine to denote the essence of God (al–Dhat).
 

Ragnarok

New Member
If you interested in further debate on this subject you should check out 'The White Goddess' by Robert Graves. In fact in his poetry, historical novels, and non fiction books Graves consistently bangs on the drum of The Goddess. His controversial historical biography 'King Jesus' hits upon this theme repeatedly and he even depicts Jesus as saying 'I've come to destroy the works of the Goddess. Furthermore, in his catalogue of the Greek Myths he adds copious notes on the historical significance behind the myths and the domination of goddesses by their male counterparts.

Also, comparative mythology scholars such as Joseph Campbell have argued that the domination of male deities corresponds to the invasion of herding societies into agrarian regions. Agricultural societies tended to embrace goddess worship due to their dependence on mother earth and when the hunting or sheparding tribes invaded their lands they brought an entirely new myth to the area. This is best depicted in the Jewish tradition where the Goddess in completely annihilated.
 
Top