Banshee vs. succubus

[Nadai]

I was watcing a Scooby Doo movie with my kids this morning and one of the monsters was a Banshee. She was going aroung screaming and damning souls and I kept thinking... 'isn't that a Succubus?'
I'd always thought that a Succubus was a beautiful, female spirit that, when she opened her mouth, a scream came out and with it a man's soul would be sucked up.
Are they one in the same or two totally different things... like Celtic and Norse myth?
Could those two be related to the Sirens of Greek myth, minus the large body of water and ship full of men?

 

[LegendofJoe]

In Irish belief, a Banshee is a type of fairy or spirit of a woman that died in childbirth.
They follow around certain families, letting them know when one of their's is going to
die by crying horribly.
In medieval demonology, a succubus is a demon that takes on a woman's shape in order to sexually assault a man.
She steals his sperm and then appears to a woman as a male called an incubus.
It then impregnates her with the sperm that it stole from its male victim.
Demons were thought to be sexless and therefore can appear as both male and female.
They were spiritual beings, so could not produce their own sperm.
(Alot of ink was spilled on thinking of such matters. Thomas Aquinas was one of them.)

 

[Nadai]

In Irish belief, a Banshee is a type of fairy or spirit of a woman that died in childbirth.
They follow around certain families, letting them know when one of their's is going to
die by crying horribly.
In medieval demonology, a succubus is a demon that takes on a woman's shape in order to sexually assault a man.
She steals his sperm and then appears to a woman as a male called an incubus.
It then impregnates her with the sperm that it stole from its male victim.
Demons were thought to be sexless and therefore can appear as both male and female.
They were spiritual beings, so could not produce their own sperm.
(Alot of ink was spilled on thinking of such matters. Thomas Aquinas was one of them.)

Thanks LoJ.
So am I to assume that a succubus and incubus steal sperm from men to implant it into women? Is that supposed to be a cruel trick on mankind? "I'm going to steal your sperm and make a baby with some random chick. HaHaHaHa!"... unfortunately there's no *maniaclly laughing* smiley!?
I guess it makes sense...
I think the legend would be better if someone lost their soul

 

[Nadai]

Demons were thought to be sexless and therefore can appear as both male and female.
They were spiritual beings, so could not produce their own sperm.
(Alot of ink was spilled on thinking of such matters. Thomas Aquinas was one of them.)

I don't remember what movie it was from... could it have been Dogma...?
There was a scene in the movie where an angel was complainging about his sex life or how difficult it is for angels to get laid. Somewhere in the conversation he rips off his pants to reaveal a lower half similar to that of the Ken doll

 

[The Taciturn Scholar]

Thanks FB.
So am I to assume that a succubus and incubus ans incubus steal sperm from men to implant it into women? Is that supposed to be a cruel trick on mankind? "I'm going to steal your sperm and make a baby with some random chick. HaHaHaHa!"... unfortunately there's no *maniaclly laughing* smiley!?
I guess it makes sense...

Correct. The results of such unions were called cambions, and often had supernatural abilities--or so say the legends. I think that King Arthur's wizard vizier was supposed to be a cambion...

Whether this whole mythology of incubi/succubi/cambions was widely believed or not, I think it was probably a way of dismissing pregnancies resultant of affairs and rapes; or, at least, it served as an accepted explanation.

 

[The Taciturn Scholar]

In Irish belief, a Banshee is a type of fairy or spirit of a woman that died in childbirth.
They follow around certain families, letting them know when one of their's is going to
die by crying horribly.

Right, and a similar creature would be the fetch; a sort of doppelganger who appears to a person shortly before they die. I think they're Irish too.

I need to read more Irish lore!

 

[Nadai]

Right, and a similar creature would be the fetch; a sort of doppelganger who appears to a person shortly before they die. I think they're Irish too.

I need to read more Irish lore!

There's a great book on Irish myth or lore, Ireland by Frank Delaney. It's a great read, though I can't remember it mentioning any "fetch".

 

[LegendofJoe]

Correct. The results of such unions were called cambions, and often had supernatural abilities--or so say the legends. I think that King Arthur's wizard vizier was supposed to be a cambion...

Yes; Merlin's mom was visited by an incubus.

 

[LegendofJoe]

Thanks FB.
So am I to assume that a succubus and incubus ans incubus steal sperm from men to implant it into women? Is that supposed to be a cruel trick on mankind? "I'm going to steal your sperm and make a baby with some random chick. HaHaHaHa!"... unfortunately there's no *maniaclly laughing* smiley!?
I guess it makes sense...
I think the legend would be better if someone lost their soul

People thought that such unions between demons and humans would lead to pregnancies. The thinkers of the time however believed that
demons were airy beings: they could manipulate air to form a type of body, but could not actually create sperm.
So they had to think of a way demons could impregnate their victims.
I suppose many never considered the possibility that people could just be lying about how they got pregnant.
As far as losing one's soul; yeah, I'm sure that got tossed in somewhere.
Dogma was a great film! Smith seems to have done his research concerning sexless demons

 

[The Taciturn Scholar]

I suppose many never considered the possibility that people could just be lying about how they got pregnant.

I was thinking more along the lines of: "Egad! There was a filthy incubus that laid with cousin Agnes and made her pregnant. Naughty incubus!" and what they really meant was.... *"We don't talk about what your Uncle William did to cousin Agnes."*

Speculation, of course.

 

[Myrddin]

People thought that such unions between demons and humans would lead to pregnancies. The thinkers of the time however believed that
demons were airy beings: they could manipulate air to form a type of body, but could not actually create sperm.
So they had to think of a way demons could impregnate their victims.
I suppose many never considered the possibility that people could just be lying about how they got pregnant.
As far as losing one's soul; yeah, I'm sure that got tossed in somewhere.
Dogma was a great film! Smith seems to have done his research concerning sexless demons

Like Anikin's mom in Star Wars. She had to be lying about how she came to bear Anikin.

 

[Nadai]

Like Anikin's mom in Star Wars. She had to be lying about how she came to bear Anikin.

?I'm seriously going to have to watch these movies... Why would Anikin's mom lie about how she got pregnant?

 

[Myrddin]

?I'm seriously going to have to watch these movies... Why would Anikin's mom lie about how she got pregnant?

Who knows? But her story is that she was never with anyone, and it was only through the stars that she came to bear Anikin Skywalker. *cough, cough* I know, it's Science Fiction and requires a leap of faith, but even for the genre, that is too much. Just doesn't work for me..

M.

 

[Nadai]

it was only through the stars that she came to bear Anikin Skywalker. *cough, cough*
M.

Sounds like any other myth "No I wasn't unfaithful! Zeus did it!"

 

[Myrddin]

Sounds like any other myth "No I wasn't unfaithful! Zeus did it!"

LOL And let's not forget the "Virgin" Mary.

M.

 

[Myrddin]

Correct. The results of such unions were called cambions, and often had supernatural abilities--or so say the legends. I think that King Arthur's wizard vizier was supposed to be a cambion...

In many versions of the legend, at the very least. Merlin was the offspring of a young nun who was raped by an incubus. That's supposedly how Merlin came by his magical abilities and powers. That's it, that's all I know! I'm not even sure if the union is supposed to allow him to live longer or not.

Has anyone watched the BBS series Merlin? Or Lost Girl?

M.

 

[Nadai]

LOL And let's not forget the "Virgin" Mary.

M.

"That's my story and I'm sticking to it." -Bonnie (FG)

 

[Nadai]

In many versions of the legend, at the very least. Merlin was the offspring of a young nun who was raped by an incubus. That's supposedly how Merlin came by his magical abilities and powers. That's it, that's all I know! I'm not even sure if the union is supposed to allow him to live longer or not.

Has anyone watched the BBS series Merlin? Or Lost Girl?

M.

That sounds like how Pegasus came to be. Medusa was a priestess and got raped by Poseidon then cursed by Athena (or Artemis I can't remember) and became a Gorgon like her other two sisters. Though, how a flying horse can be born from the seed of the god of the sea and the blood of a Gorgon I'm not sure. I think there may have been some holes in Medusa's story.... Or possibly it was a horse because Poseidon created horses... Who knows.

Lost Girl definitely. From both seasons I only missed one episode (Season 1's finale!) I could watch it on Netflix, but I'm too lazy . That was a good series; I think it comes back next year, right? I still haven't seen Merlin through yet, though.

 

[Alejandro]

It was Athena who transformed Medusa into a Gorgon. According to Ovid's Metamorphoses, Poseidon and Medusa's offspring was winged because the sea-king had assumed the form of a bird in order to rape Medusa. According to the Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology, some other ancient writer says that Poseidon took on the guise of a horse in order to commit the crime. It's the same reason the Oceanid Philyra gave birth to a Centaur: she and the Centaur's father the Titan Kronos had assumed the form of horses when the Centaur Kheiron [Cheiron, or Chiron] was conceived.

 

[Nadai]

It was Athena who transformed Medusa into a Gorgon. According to Ovid's Metamorphoses, Poseidon and Medusa's offspring was winged because the sea-king had assumed the form of a bird in order to rape Medusa. According to the Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology, some other ancient writer says that Poseidon took on the guise of a horse in order to commit the crime. It's the same reason the Oceanid Philyra gave birth to a Centaur: she and the Centaur's father the Titan Kronos had assumed the form of horses when the Centaur Kheiron [Cheiron, or Chiron] was conceived.

Thanks.