Everyone ignores the homophobia of the 2004 troy movie

Discussion in 'Greek Mythology' started by Kurvos, May 30, 2014.

  1. Kurvos

    Kurvos New Member

    This is frustrating the living Hell (or Tartarus?) out of me. Whenever I see people review Troy, they ignore the one thing about it that really, REALLY hurts me.
    As some of you may know - in Homer's Iliad, Achilles and Patroclus are clearly established to be lovers. They were basically boyfriends - had sex and all that stuff. In the movie? They are strictly emphasized to be cousins and making it 100% platonic, we get reminders every so often on how proud they all are about being straight, and they even forced in a pointless FEMALE love interest for Achilles to have sex with so they'll please the homophobes.

    I can not describe how much this frustrates and hurts me. I wish from the bottom of my heart we will soon enough get a more accurate portrayal of the Trojan War in a movie - with the Gods involved, with Achilles established to be a demigod, with the war taking place for 10 years, with a "Odyssey" spin-off sequel... and of course, with Achilles and Patroclus being lovers.
    But once again, what bothers me is how annoyingly delusional people are about this. It's funny, reviewers tend to talk like they know what happens in Homer's Iliad... yet, they forget that detail about the homosexual romance?! What the ****...
    Nadai likes this.
  2. Caburus

    Caburus Active Member

    There were so many things wrong with this film that its best to just dismiss it as a modern version of the story - minus any of the accuracy!

    But Greek mythology is not so clear on Achilles strict homosexuality as you imply. Myths say that Achilles fell in love with Penthesilia, the Amazon queen, whom he later unknowingly killed in the Trojan war, and that he was also planning to marry Polyxena, Priam's daughter, when he died. In Homer's 'Iliad' Achilles refers to Briseis as his bride and wife, and Achilles famously had a son, Neoptolemus, who was ancestor to the Kings of Epirus, and whom Alexander the Great was proud to acknowledge as his ancestor (prompting him to seek the site of Troy and pay honour at the tomb of Achilles that stood there).

    This does not stop Achilles being bisexual, of course, but the film's female love interest for him is plausible.
    Nadai likes this.
  3. Kurvos

    Kurvos New Member

    Alright, fair enough. Still... it really pisses me off they forced in a woman just to give him someone to **** of the opposite gender. -_- I'm so tired of homophobia...
    You have no idea what I would do to see them dare to include homosexuality in mainstream cinema - Greek Mythology would be perfect for that.
  4. Misa

    Misa Member

    I never expect to see what I think of as "accurate" mythology in movies, because of movies like Troy - and pretty much all the other modern ones. Now, what I would love to see in myth-to-movie is the whole Pelops the victim of Tantalus at the feast of the gods he hosted. Pelops was a grandson of Zeus and son of Tantalus and Dione, the daughter of Atlas

    In which Pelops shoulder was eaten by either Demeter or Gaia; Zeus recognized the deception (her reaction?) and the Moirai cast his parts into a boiling cauldron - all but the shoulder that Demeter had tasted, which was replaced with one of ivory. Pelops became the beloved of Poseidon, who gifted him with a chariot of (sometimes winged) horses upon Pelops asking for help in the task of taking a wife (!) and winning a chariot race against Oenomaus to wed Hippodamia. It was with these horses that he won.

    When Cillus (also named Sphaerus) his charioteer died, Pelops made a temple to Apollo Cillaeus and further founding a city Cilla for him. Cillus after death apparently helped Pelops in the chariot race. (I like that version better than that of the charioteer Myrtilus the son of Hermes killing Oenomaus at the request of either Pelops or Hippodamia - and being killed for his help by Pelops. But, I suppose both can be viewed as "true" so far as myth goes.)

    Pelops had another son by either Axioche or the nymph Danais -Chrysippus, who may have been older and certainly favored by Pelops to become king after him. Laius (the father of Oedipus) was welcomed into the kingdom of Pelops as tutor to Chrysippus (interestingly the Pelops was the brother of Niobe who married Amphion) Laius he had been raised by Lycus, former king of Thebes and when misfortune brought about the end of twin kings of Thebes Amphion and Zethus he became king.

    Laius kidnapped him on way to Nemean Games or while teaching him to drive a chariot and became his lover in Thebes. At this Chrysippus either killed himself and with his death doomed Laius, his family and the city of Thebes.

    "Laius, son of Labdacus, carried of Chrysippus, illegitimate son of Pelops, at the Nemean Games because of his exceeding beauty. Pelops made war and recovered him. At the instigation of their mother Hippodamia, Atreus and Thyestes killed him. When Pelops blamed Hippodamia, she killed herself." - Fabulae

    "Pelops, the son of Tantalos and Euryanassa, married Hippodameia and begat Atreus and Thyestes; but by the nymphe Danaïs he had Khrysippos, whom he loved more than his legitimate sons. But Laïos the Theban conceived a desire for him and carried him off; and, although he was arrested by Thyestes and Atreus, he obtained mercy from Pelops because of his love. But Hippodameia tried to persuade Atreus and Thyestes to do away with Khrysippos, since she knew that he would be a contestant for the kingship; but when they refused, she stained her hands with the pollution. For at dead of night, when Laïos was asleep, she drew his sword, wounded Khrysippos, and fixed the sword in his body. Laïos was suspected because of the sword, but was saved by Khrysippos, who, though half-dead, acknowledged the truth. Pelops buried Khrysippos and banished Hippodameia. So Dositheüs in his Descendants of Pelops " - Greek and Roman Parallel Stories

    It is interesting to note that like Oenomaus the father of Hippodamia (where it is a son in law); Laius is prophesied to have a son that would kill him too.
  5. Last Spartan

    Last Spartan New Member

    Briseis is the name of Achilles' Trojan concubine in the Iliad as well, although her backstory was different in the film. She was taken by Agamemnon when he was forced to return Chryseis to her father in order to avert the plague struck on the Greek army by Apollo, thereby causing Achilles to withdraw himself and his Myrmidons from the war. Are you suggesting they forced in an actual character from the Iliad?

    I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what your saying, but it's not as if the character was simply made up for the movie.
  6. Yasser Zammen

    Yasser Zammen New Member

    Have you read the Iliad?

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